Stanier 8F footplate modifications

I have to say that I feel a little foolish about this, but as a warning to others ….  See if you could/would have made the same error.

Footplate etch

Original Footplate etch

The frames of my model 8F in Scale Seven I have decided to make at 29mm outside width (see previous posts).  The nice etch of the main footplate made by Modern Outline Kits is for their Finescale construction, so the inside edges of the footplate would be too narrow for my model, and would hang over the insides of the frames.

Footplate etch with extra rivetsIt might not matter too much, but I thought this should be easily corrected, so I decided to re-form the line of rivets which runs parallel to the inside edge, then cut back the edge wherever it shows.  I don’t have a rivet-forming tool which can precisely measure out and positon the rivets, but by careful measuring and scratching marks on the underside of the footplate, I seem to have managed a reasonable job.  I also scratched on the footplate the width of the frames, ready to cut back the inside edges.

So far so good.  I thought.

Footplate modified

Footplate modified

Next I cut back the frame edges, carefully cutting (piercing saw)  and filing straight edges.

Trial fit to frames: mistake exposed: what width should I have made the distance across the inside edges of the footplate?

NOT 29mm!

It should have been 29mm less twice the thickness of the frames – 27.5mm.  So the footplate now ended just outside of the frames!  This would look even worse than the overhang which I had decided to remove.  What can I now do?

Footplate corrected.

Footplate corrected.

I found some 0.7mm nickel-silver wire which I had left over from a previous project, and carefully soldered it along the inside of the frames.  Look carefully at the last picture (click to enlarge any of the pictures) and you might be able to spot the differences!

Oh, well!

Stanier 8F in Scale Seven, Part 4

Onto the next bit. Whilst I wait for the S7 wheels to become available, I have tried to progress with other parts of the engine. The next bit in the instructions which I have is the pony truck. So I started on this.
Small Pony Truck 1Here is the basic construction.

As can be seen, there is no compensation on the pony truck. I doubt that this is necessary, because there will be a little bit of lateral sway of the mechanism once in place, and so with only one axle surely compensation will not be required?

 

So should I add weight to the box-like centre of the pony truck?  I decided to do so, and carved a piece of lead weight from a truck-tyre balancing weight obtained from our local tyre-fitting place, to fit in the centre of the pony-truck.

Of course I’ll have to wait a while before seeing if this works!
Incidentally, I have a works diagram of the engine, and the frames of the pony truck in this kit are the correct distance apart (±0.5 mm, which is good enough for me) without modification.

Next I constructed the rear steps, and the moved on to the front footplate sub-assembly. This is a great example of how the parts can be put together “dry” – no solder – because of the excellent tab-and-slot construction.

Small Footplate and frames fitting 2

Frames and footplate from opposite the rear steps. The footplate is stopped from fitting down onto the frames by the upright used to hold the motor.

In making this sub-assembly, I came across a minor problem.

Small Footplate and frames fitting 1

Frames and footplate seen from the front quarter. Note the front footplate sub-assembly is in place on the main footplate etch.

As can be seen in this picture, the problem is that the upright frame for the motor mount has a width of 29mm, whilst the distance between the edges of the footplate is 26.5mm.
It’s not a major problem, at first glance, and probably the answer could be simply to make a couple of small cut-outs in the footplate – 1.25 mm each side is only a small amount.   However before doing this I asked on a Scale Seven Web forum called Western Thunder (westernthunder.co.uk) to see if there was an alternative solution which anyone could see. Making cuts in the footplate is all very well, but what the effect on the later construction and the overall end-appearance I couldn’t yet tell.

 

It was suggested that the inside width of the footplate had been narrowed (making the footplates on either side a little bit too wide) in order to fit the narrower frames in Finescale 0-gauge.  This proved to be correct, so with my correct width frames I need to file or cut off some metal from the inside edge of both sides of the footplate to make it match with the top edges of the frames.

The footplate is exactly the correct external dimension, but the footplate width on each side is 16.7-16.8 mm. Taking this back to the correct width of 15mm will remove the line of rivets.  I could probably re-create these, however.  Probably it would be best to line them up before I file back the inside of the footplate edges.  The nickel-silver sheet, even over the etched areas, is still 0.5mm thick.  This will affect the small slots used to locate some other parts.  I don’t know as yet what parts are affected, but I will just have to find that out as I go along, I fear.

I was just about to set off and form the rivets on the footplate, then take 1.5mm off the inside of each footplate side, when another factor entered my brain, and it is just as well (I think) that it did.
Small Footplate and frames fitting 4If I took 1.5mm off the inside of each side of the footplate, then the whitemetal cast firebox would no longer fit as intended on the inside edges of the footplate.
Small Footplate and frames fitting 6

This might not matter, because the firebox would still fit on the frames themselves.

So if I made the inside dimension of the footpale sides nearly the same as the inside dimension of the frames then I thought that it would work. The inside dimension of the frames is 28mm. The inside dimension of the footplate is 26.5mm as supplied.

So if I took 1.0 mm off the inside of the footplate each side, the edges would sit on the middle of the frame each side, which would probably look OK, and the firebox could sit on the frame edges.  The only (?!) problem to remain would be that the line of etched rivets on each inside edge of the footplate sits right on top of the line to which I would need to reduce the footplate inner-dimension. Tricky.

So it was tempting to leave the footplate as it is, just cut back the motor-mount.  However this would leave the footplate overhanging the inside of the frames, which would not look very good.  File the original etched “rivets” flat, then reform them with my special rivet tool?

In all of this, advice from members of the WT forum showed me that I was going to have to cut the motor-mounting back, and reinforce it from within the width of the whitemetal firebox.  A slightly daunting task, but eventually I’ve taken the plunge ….. Bitten the bullet ….. etc.

Small Motor mounting Mods 1I used some rectangular-section brass to strengthen the motor mount, soldered into place.
Small Motor mounting Mods 4Then I cut off the frame uprights, and part of the motor mount. As can be seen, the footplate can now lie on the frames. Good.

 

 

Even better, the firebox goes over the motor mount!
In this view it is possible to see how well this model goes into the ScaleSeven arena: the firebox is exactly the correct width, even though the model was originally intended for Finescale.

Inspecting the footplate now, it becomes clear (see diagram below) that I will only have to shave the 1mm off the inside of the footplate for the length between the two vertical arrows which I have put on the picture.
Footplate etch with arrowsThe rest is covered by the parts representing the frames above footplate level.

The angled arrow shows one of the slots into which the parts representing the frames where they are visible above the footplate will fit: just outside of the firebox moulding.
Interestingly, they are exactly 29mm across the outside dimension – as are the frames which I have built.

Of course I shouldn’t be surprised really, but it is reassuring.

Stanier 8F in Scale7 part 3

Cylinders, slidebar, crosshead and some valve gear.

Cylinders, slidebar, crosshead and some valve gear.

I have been contructing part of the valve gear, as shown.

The detail of this kit is such that the combination lever, with a complex shape at its top, if faithfully reproduced.  Unfortunately this means that the  where the lever goes through the crosshead of the piston valve (see the diagram at the top for the names of these tiny bits of brass!) it is such a tight fit that there is not enough movement in the model form.

 

These are pictures of the piston valve shaft and crosshead (all one moulding) and the combination lever.  Unmodified as yet.

Combination lever - unmodified

Combination lever – unmodified

Small PV Xhead unmodified

Piston valve shaft and crosshead – all one piece of “lost wax” casting.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Small Combi lever and PV Xhead modified annotatedThey both have to be carefully filed back to allow the combi. lever to move through an angle of about 25 degree either side of verticle in the crosshead.

 

 

Small Frames with 2 cylinders

The story so far: frames with both cylinders, motion brackets and valve gear attached

 

 

Click to see progress.

Old ‘blog entries – building the Industrial Garratt locomotive (2011 entries)

Actually, this is a tale which goes back to before the coulshed.com website existed, and then the website changed (at the beginning of 2012), so I am reconstructing the entries from before January 2012, in order.

Painted and airbrush weathered from above

Click on any picture to enlarge it !

The start of making my model industrial 0-4-0+0-4-0 Beyer-Garratt in Scale Seven goes back to the middle of 2010.  The kit was a decade in my cupboards waiting for me to summon the courage to tackle four sets of valve gear, never having constructed a model with valve gear before!  The kit was a very basic one, designed for Finescale, “0-gauge”, and I decided to make it with near true scale-width frames, as well as the rest of S7 standards.

This meant that my first difficulty was to adapt the spacers for the driving-unit frames.  The kit had “fold-up” frames, held also at the desired width by the buffer-beams and spacers on the inside end of the driving units.

Frames with scoring BandWI was also planning to fit suspension to every axle, so slots to accept the suspension unit had to be cut in the frames themselves.  

This picture shows the flat fold-up frames with the scored markings to cut out the wide slots for the suspension units.  The actual frames are seen above and below a horizontal plate, with the original axle holes about to be cut out.

 

Cylinder end plate with extra cuts

The buffer-beams and other spacers had to have new slots cut into them at the new width (29mm).

 

 

Cylinder end spacers adapted cropped

 

In the end the slots were just widened and scrap brass added to set the width of the frames, as shown.

 

 

Frames upside down to show the slots for the suspension units

Frames upside down to show the slots for the suspension units

 

This was all very worrying, as it appeared to be a very destructive approach to kit-building!  Fortunately all the calculations appeared to be working when I assembled the frames, as shown.

 

 

 

Front driving unit, from the front.

Front driving unit, from the front.

 

 

If you look carefully it is possible to see where the buffer-beam slots have been widened for the scale-width frames.

 

 

 

There then ensued a long struggle with the suspension units, the wheels, the “plunger” pick-ups and the coupling rods, just to get the units to move under their own power.

So many times I wondered if it was beyond me ….

This takes us up to the start of 2011, and the start of our website.  The valve gear was yet to be done.

April 2011
Connecting rod state 2 smallI should be able to put together some more of my model Garratt locomotive – an 040+040 industrial steam engine.  Here’s a picture of the front end driving unit as so far built.  The trouble building this to exact scale dimensions (Scale Seven) is a story in itself ….Valve gear rods smallLooking after (ie staying in the house at the same time) as the two boys has some advantages: I took some time to construct some more of my Garratt.

Here’s my first ever construction of outside valve gear for a model steam engine – and it moves !  Valve gear in place from the rear smallWhat makes it difficult is to make the joints all move.  On the assembly shown below there are five joints made with brass pins soldered to etched brass valve gear “rods”.  the pins are about 0.8mm diameter, 5mm long, and clearly the solder only has to fix the pin to one rod, and not the other.  There are about ten joints like this for each set of valve gear – and there are four sets.
I’m very proud to have successfully complete one!Front tank from rear smallBunker from front small

 

June 2011

As you can see, both sets of driving wheels are now complete with coupling and connecting rods, plus valve gear.
Valve gear completed 4 s Valve_gear_completed_3_s
If only I could put moving pictures on the website, I could proudly demonstrate how it all moves and proceeds along the track!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Front_driving_unit_partially_complete_1_sI have now fitted the bunker and the water tank onto the diving wheel assemblies of my model Garratt locomotive ….

Rear driving unit partially complete 3 s

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

October 2011

Smallpic_Both_drive_units_nearly_finishedMy model of the industrial Garratt “William Francis” is coming along quite well, now.

The first picture is of the two end units, with the rear one containing the coal bunker on the left and the front unit with a water tank on the right.

Smallpic Central unit nearly finishedThis is the central unit, with the boiler and cab.
It’s a very complicated model, and the kit (originally bought by me over a decade ago), is far from perfect or comprehensive.  It’s really just a starting point for building a model of this industrial locomotive – adding detail is very much needed.  However that is the part which I enjoy most, so that is certainly OK by me.

November 2011

My Garratt.  It’s an 0-4-0+0-4-0 locomotive.  The prototype ran in an industrial complex centred around a large coal mine in Warwickshire.  It’s taken me a year to get this far, being quite a complex project.  Here you are, though.  Just three minor details to go (nameplates and a clack valve on the right hand side of the boiler).

Almost finished 3 small

Almost finished 2 small

Almost finished 6 small

Then it will be on to the painting …

December 2011

So what have I been doing?

Primer Right lateral smallWell, the Garratt has progressed.  The construction is now finished, and I’ve put the primer on it.  It now looks a little like the prototype did when it emerged from the Beyer-Peacock work in Manchester and had its picture taken in “works grey”:

Also, I have decided that I should but no more model kits until I have built the one that I already have!  A radical approach I know, and judging by the article that I read, many other people have multitudes of kits lying arond the house waiting to be started.  The first benefit of this policy is that I have started to make the model of an LNWR gunpowder van.  I’m not sure that the LNWR ever actually had such wagons.  I have never been able to find a photograph of one like this kit is supposed to represent, and the instruction sheet which comes with the model is vague, inaccurate in parts, and covers several different models.  The attraction of the model is that the LNWR is reputed to have painted these gunpowder vans vermillion, so I could legitimately have a bright red wagon on my railway!  There is some doubt that this colour is true: the claim about the colour may be based upon a crude tinplate model made by Bassett-Lowke in the nineteen-fifties!  Nevertheless I shall build one.

Gunpowder van small

 

Here it is (as far as I have reached!):

 

 

 

 

For more entries, follow the links at the top or bottom of the pages, to go to “older posts”.

Video files from Melbourne

It has taken me some time to get these loaded, but here are a few video files of Richard Davidson’s circuit of track at his home outside Melbourne (a place called Melton).  This outdoor circuit is huge!  Richard tells me it is 60 yards around the loop, which is about a scale 2½ kilometers!

My industrial Garratt ran well, and so I want to celebrate this fact!

There are small files and larger ones, depending on how broad your broadband is

(is it a Gillard-government one, or an Abbott govt. one?).

WF outdoors 1 small  <-Small   Large -> WF outdoors 1

We loaded up the Garratt with 27 wagons: WF at RDs house

WF outdoors 2 small  <-Small   Large -> WF outdoors 2

I don’t think that the real one could have hauled this many!

WF outdoors 3 small <-Small   Large -> WF outdoors 3

In the last video it is possible to see Richard’s superb model of a North British 0-4-2 locomotive going in the opposite direction around his double loop of track.

Scale Seven in Melbourne

I spent a pleasant day in Melton, near Melbourne.  It was a day-trip (!) from Sydney to see fellow-ScaleSeven enthusiasts Richard Davidson and John Ritter.  The original idea had been to go to the VicG0G meeting, but somehow we never actually made it there.

Small WF outdoorsThis was mainly because Richard has a wonderful outdoor circuit, upon which we could run our trains.

 

 

 

S7 in Melbourne u - WF on the curved trackRichard has a large shed in the back garden, out of which the railway comes.  It then goes around a circuit of more than 50m of track and back into the other side of the same shed.

 

 

 

S7 in Melbourne s - WF from aboveAs you can see, I took my industrial Garratt (William Francis) down to Melbourne with me.  I’m pleased to say that WF ran very well during the day.

 

 

Small WF with 27 wagonsThe Garratt could haul a load of 27 wagons, which is the most it has ever pulled.  I do not have that many trucks myself, and in any case Richard’s wagons are better -built that my own, and offer less rolling-resistance, I suspect.

It drew 450mA current with or without a load of wagons, which is good even though it means there is probably too much friction in the locomotive running gear itself.  It ran so well that we left it running round and round for hours, which probably loosened up the running gear nicely.

Small Richards Caledonian engineRichard has some lovely locomotives as well as his magnificent collection of private owner wagons.

This one is Caledonian Railway 0-4-2 No 705, designed by George Brittain and built by Dubs in 1881.

As usual, click on pictures to enlarge.

In Richards words: it is scratchbuilt except for the gears (plastic, two start worm, 11:1 ratio ex motor car window winder).  The motor is ex computer, from Proops at $2.50, draws 12 mA light, 30 mA with gearbox and about 100-200 mA on a train. The wheels were fretted out of brass and insulated with a strip of thin perspex between the centre and the tyre.

Small Richards wooden-clad engine The second one is North British Railway 0-4-2 No 26, a mixed traffic engine built in 1845 by R & W Hawthorn of Leith. The original was fitted with a patent valve gear in which reversing and cut-off were controlled by separate levers. The valve was in two parts that slid over each other and the valve rod was hollow, with the cut-off rod inside it.

Again, Richards words: I built the engine with a crank axle but have got no further with the valve gear. The motor is a Mashima 1824 in the firebox, driving through a cut-away (27:1) North West Short Lines idler gearbox. The final drive gear is on the axle between the eccentrics and the idler gear is meshed with the worm in what is left of the gearbox. The mesh between the drive gear and the idler can be adjusted. The engine is also scratchbuilt except for the motor and gears. The livery is guesswork..

Small  WF at track level

8F progress

I’ve been working slowly on the “motion bracket” and the slidebars and crosshead assembly, toghether with some of the valve gear.

Here are some pictures of the progress so far:

Union link and radius bar - note the Y-shaped ends

Union link and radius bar – note the Y-shaped ends

Radius bar and expansion link.

Radius bar and expansion link.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Click to enlarge

Radius bar and expansion link in position, in the motion bracket.

Radius bar and expansion link in position, in the motion bracket.

Motion bracket, etc., in position on the frames.

Motion bracket, etc., in position on the frames.

 

 

 

 

 

 

A few notes of explanation.  The first shot shows the laminated rods, with bifurcated ends to allow joints with other pieces of valve gear: see the union link in the fourth picture (parallel to and below the cylinder slidebars); the expansion link is the curved piece through which the radius arm travels.  In most models the radius arm is left in a neutral position, thoguh the centre of the expansion link.  This is convenient, as the centre of the expansion link is the pivot about which it moves forward and back, but for the radius arm to be there is to have the model always in neutral gear.  So instead I am making my model in a forward gear, with the radius rod just below the central expansion link.  The radius arm will move forwards and back a very small amount as a consequence, but the construction should be able to be done reasonably easily (I think).

It’s possible to see this in the pictures if you look closely.  I had to create a pivot for the radius arm just below the central pivot of the expansion link.

Cylinders, slidebar, crosshead and some valve gear.

Cylinders, slidebar, crosshead and some valve gear.

 

The whole construction is made to come off the frames for ease of maintenance and building.

Not complete, of course.

 

Stanier 8F in Scale Seven – first post

I have started to build a model Stanier 8F locomotive in 7mm scale, 33 mm gauge – Scale Seven.  It is a Modern Outline Kits model, and Dave Sharp, of MOK, is being very helpful: it is a kit made for “0-Gauge”, and he is making a special conversion kit, to allow construction in 33mm gauge (a prerequisite of S7) with widened frames (29mm outside width).

Frames in construction: the spacers between the frames have been soldered to one frame only.

Frames in construction: the spacers between the frames have been soldered to one frame only.

So far, the kit seems extremely well thought-through.  The conversion kit works well so far, also.  Correct frame width in 7mm scale would be 30mm O/D, but in discussion with DS, he and I agreed that to do this would leave so little room for manoevre that it would make the kit very difficult if not impossible to make.  This kit appears to have the girders and plates between the frames made to scale as far as possible.

Frame, showing the compensation mechanism and the insulated driving wheel bearings ("hornblocks").

Frame, showing the compensation mechanism and the insulated driving wheel bearings (“hornblocks”).

There is an elaborate method of “compensation” – a mechanism to alow the axles a limited amount of up-and-down movement.

 

 

Frames together: if you look carefully you can see the blobs of solder on the nearer frame.

Frames together: if you look carefully you can see the blobs of solder on the nearer frame.

These are the frames put together, all “squared-up”, but so far with solder only on the one frame (just visible as blobs on the outside of the nearer frame – I will have carefully to flatten them after construction, and there will be only about as millimeter between the frame and the inside of the wheels.

The kit clearly has the potential to make a superb model of this freight locomotive.

Figures for 7mm

s 7mm Figures 4

 

John has painted some figures for the model railway in Australia.  I brought them back from Europe and have added eyes and mouths to the painting.

 

s 7mm Figures 1They look really good, I think, so here they are.  There must have been a union meeting to get them all together.

Video files

I have spend this weekend doing gardening and playing with the computers.  I’d like to think of it as working with the computers, but it isn’t really: I have been working out how to put video files on the website.

Actually putting the files on the website isn’t at all difficult.  The one I put on “Australian Family pictures from the 2000s” (of Nick debating in Youth Parliament) was easy, partly because someone had already put it on YouTube.

I have been doing movie “clips” of my Scale Seven model locomotive, and it’s difficult to get the format, resolution, frames-per-second settings right to load onto the ‘net.  The first two are relatively small files:

William Francis 1 small

William Francis 2 small

The picture quality is poor, I think.  Beware, though, the two below (my first attempts) are very large files and “froze” my Windows PC when I tried to open them.  Given time, patience, and a Mac, and they open nicely though, with much better detail in the pictures.  The problem relates to file size, I think.  LATER: sadly I have also discovered that as they are mp4 files (chosen because they are the most compact format), Microsoft doesn’t like them.  Using the VLC player or  the Real Player may help, also.  *&%$#@ Microsoft ….

William Francis 1

The second one is a little smaller ….

William Francis 2

..